Currently, we have two mechanics:
The more Ki you inject, the stronger the attack.
At the moment, both bars are used simultaneously. This means you can perform an SP attack with either a small or large amount of Ki, depending on how much is injected. For example, a Spirit Bomb could have 5 full bars of Ki.
While this system works, it leads to odd scenarios, like rush attacks that can either defeat an enemy in one hit or barely damage them based on the Ki level, which feels inconsistent.
My suggestion is to separate the two bars. When performing an SP attack, only the SP bar would be used, leaving the Ki bar untouched. This way, the damage from an SP attack will always be consistent, which I believe will improve the gameplay and the pace of the game.
Another good example would be the possibility for a fighter without Ki to be able to launch a SP attack.
The only downside that I see is the size of the Spirit Bomb that was dictated by the amount of Ki injected into the SP attack.
What do you think about this approach?
I'm looking for well-thought-out responses only, as simple "react" responses like those found on social media never helps.
Thanks
I'll talk from a very ignorant point of view of how the code behind the game works, but I think this is not the best idea.
I think it only makes sense that Ki attacks such as the Spirit Bomb, Makankosappo, Final Flash, Kienzan, etc. use Ki to be performed, and I really like how the more Ki you inject to it, the more damage it will do. It would be weird that the legendary spirit bomb would grow depending on how much you punched your opponent.
I also think that making these attacks be charged exclusively with the SP bar will make the game less fun. Charging the SP bar can get annoying if you want to have a couple of bars in your disposal, and is even worse to try and max it. I think it is perfect -and fun- that it only serves to determine wether you can perform and SP attack or not, and that then it is up to your Ki to determine how strong the attack is. Also by the time you have like 3 SP bars you opponent is likely already dead so I don't know how much would it be worth the effort to charge a SP attack to the max 😀
But the problems you listed are true as well, specially when it comes to the Rush attack. I think (And I hope is feasible) that we can limit this change to the Rush attack, and maybe the healing ability among other special that are not "convetional".
With this, attacks such as the giant Ki spheres and Ki waves (the ones I listed above) should keep working as they are now, while the Rush attacks and healings would have a fixed amount of damage/HP and cost one SP bar as they already do. (If you want to spice it up maybe it can do more damage the more SP bars you have stored, I'll let you decide that I like both options)
I think the upcoming Self-destruction rework and the Time-skip could work like this as well.
I think it's a great idea.
- Rush Super is balanced and doesn't kill in one hit.
- Less Charging and more fighting
- Encourages aggressive play
- Doesn't punish players for wasting their Ki since they can use it without having any.
- If they have a lot of SP, they could spam the move without having to charge, although this doesn't seem too dangerous.
A couple questions:
Moves like Spirit Bomb/Genki Dama that grow bigger if you put more Ki into them, how will they grow bigger now that Ki isn't a part of the Super Attacks?
Same thing with Beams like Father-Son Kamehameha/Final Flash/Ray Blast.
Same thing with Time-Stop (Also I think Time Stop needs a slight buff so that it lasts a bit longer).
Overall, I agree with this change 😁
Personalmente no considero que este cambio sea bueno. Le quita bastante factor de estrategia al juego, simplificando su gameplay y siendo algo menos intuitivo a mi parecer.
Claro, el medidor SP permite que los ataques especiales NO sean spameados, pero hacerlo una barra completamente independiente además de implicar varios cambios en el código, ajustar diferentes tipos de poderes especiales que funcionan con mecánicas concretas, etc, siento que dará más problemas que beneficios.
Utilizar el Ki para aumentar la efectividad de los ataques especiales es un costo/beneficio bastante bueno para el jugador, porque implica el esfuerzo de haber utilizado toda su energía para realizar estos poderes especiales y más el embutirlos de poder adicional. Que el enemigo te esquive el movimiento implica un sacrificio en tus recursos de Ki y SP, pero si aciertas es un beneficio adicional.
Eliminar parte de esta mecánica entre Ki y SP es una pésima idea a mi parecer.
Al fin y al cabo, la discusión surgió debido a un bug concreto que ocurriría con Bra, otros personajes como Dende también sufren problemas porque claro, cuentan con barra de Ki, pero no con mi blast/ki waves y la verdad el problema NO es con la barra SP, sino con el mismo poder de Ki blast/ki wave.
Otro error era Krillin (police), quien en su primera forma no podía utilizar el kienzan debido a que usaba balas en vez de ki blast, lo que se podría hacer sería independizar los ki blast/ki wave de la barra SP, pero NO separar la barra de Ki de la barra SP.
Abrir la posibilidad de que personajes que NO tienen ki blast en su arsenal de movimientos podría permitir que estos puedan utilizar sin ningún tipo de problema los SP, por lo que sería cosa de ajustar y separar la función de ki blast/ki wave de los SP para una mayor libertad en cuanto los movimientos especiales que puedan tener personajes.
P.S: Concuerdo con Jo4kyx con que los Rush attacks o la curación podrían tener un daño fijo, más que nada porque son movimientos más difíciles y diversos, como a su vez por algunas propuestas que se planean hacer por parte del team, algunos Rush Attacks nuevos no deberían necesitar de Ki (siguiendo la lógica de la serie)
I'm with Jo4kyx and GKuro on this one, I agree with the part that there is a problem here, but I think the solution could be less severe.
When a Spirit Bomb or any projectile takes away more than half of your life bar it doesn't feel unfair, because you have to charge it all first and that implies that you're giving the enemy time to react. It's like a "high risk - high reward" kind of thing, so It works great just as it is.
But on the other hand, a Rush Attack is INDEED a more unfair attack because it doesn't follow this principle. It just skips the whole part where you have to charge it and inmediatly gives you the attack with the full power in the moment you excecute it.
So instead of changing the entire special attacks system and making "all attacks pay for it", I think It would be more apropiate to just nerf the move that's being problematic. So I propose 2 different solutions:
-Make only the Rush Attack work with the SP bar.
-To make it less OP we can reduce the maximum damage that the attack can do, and to make it less useless we can increase the minimum damage that the attack can do.