Until now, recovering from a fall was too easy—just double-tap and you're back. Way too easy for serial tappers.

To balance this, recovery will now cost Ki. This means if a fighter doesn't have enough Ki to recover, they'll become a target for a c-c-c-c-c-combo until they slam to the ground.

This isn't a 'should I do this' topic. I'm doing it.
This is just an announcement and a space for tweaks.

And it’s done. The amount of Ki required to recover is currently set to 25, which is a quarter of a full bar. This also matches the amount needed to fire a gun or laser, ensuring those fighters can still recover from a fall.

This needs to be tested, so that the game doesn't become too easy, or too hard. But I believe it's going to be fun 🙂

I just tested it, and a couple things have been overlooked:

First, Some fighters don't have KI.

This means, if a fighter can't fire energy blasts, then they basically are forced to bounce around and be combo'd as soon as they're knocked down, without any way to get out of it regardless of the situation. Furthermore, certain characters ONLY have KI for transformations, like with DBS Mr. Satan. For characters like him, despite mechanically being the exact same as the other Mr. Satan's, he is able to recover when other versions can't.

I think conceptually, the idea is very good, but I think the implementation might have to be adjusted for cases like these. Unless you think all characters without KI should never be able to recover. That might make sense since it usually only applies to weak characters, but there ARE strong characters without KI, like transformed Tupper, or skilled fighters without KI, like Nam.

Second, it seems EXTREMELY easy to get characters in an infinite combo. After a single close-combat to a character without KI, I was able to combo them to death without ever letting them regain control of their character, through 3 health bars.

Thanks for following along and for your clear review.

I’ve seen the AI relentlessly beat any opponent to death when they’re cornered, but I haven’t tested the specific fighters you mentioned. I’ll deactivate that tomorrow.

However, I’d really like to discourage users from constantly double-tapping and instead let fighters stay airborne a bit longer when punched. I’ll think about how to approach that.

Personally, what I'm about to suggest, I DON'T think is a good idea. I don't think new bars need to be added that would complicate the game, I think using the established mechanics (like KI is currently being used) is a better idea. Not to mention, using established things are likely easier to implement.

But, just to suggest it for the sake of suggesting it, there could be a stamina bar, like in Xenoverse.

In Xenoverse, you have these stocks of stamina, and you use them for evasive actions. You could use 1 stock in order to recover, and they would gradually refill over time, and refill faster when loading energy? That way, even if you're out out stamina and are being combo'd, eventually it would refill enough to escape the combo instead of letting it go on forever. And all characters would have a stamina bar, even fighters without KI?

I thought about that too, but that is an entirely new problem for another time. So I rolled back what I did yesterday.
Nice mockup, by the way 😉

I made a research on how different db games approach the recovery move, and what I found is that in most cases the answer is either a timed reaction to counter attack your opponent, or holding/smashing buttons, but sincerely I don't think we need more spamming in the game, it also depended on hp bars (the less life the harder it is to regain control) and sometimes ki bars as well, but as it has already been discussed, using ki while being a solid choice, it also has its counters.

So, after testing the mechanics of the game a lot, I think the best way to implement this is actually pretty easy, and that way is not letting any character, whether they use ki or not, recover from being launched for a specific short period of time, this time should be long enough for someone skilled to have the chance of hitting their opponent again before they're able to move, but not too long so it becomes easy and also unfair for those who are getting launched, I think a second could be a reasonable gap, and after that second passes they could regain control by just double tapping as it is right now.

I tested this with two characters with very different stats to see how it worked:

As seen in the videos, you can continue the combo without letting your opponent stand within about a second, even with different characters, this way you're encouraging players to get better and find the fastest way to lunge their enemies while they're in the air and also keep them there so they don't recover, instead of just dash attacking when they're close, and it's not unfair because you're actually working for it.

After rereading that last post and watching the videos more closely, I came up with something even simpler:
A fighter can only recover from a fall after touching the ground at least once.

It's already implemented for you guys to try, and honestly, I'm super happy with that method.

I’ve been watching the AIs battle for a while. And wow, it’s so much more intense now that they don’t instantly recover from falls.
It’s honestly great to watch 🤩

Amazing! I've been playing quite a bit and it works fantastically, I even want to share some play I made while trying story mode:

My only suggestion would be that maybe the only time you can't recover after hitting the ground the first time, is if you hit the ground right after receiving a Dash Attack that knocked you towards the ground, without having hit a wall before, but either way it's awesome.

Oh wow. That is cool. Thanks a lot 🤩

I really liked your excellent combos, until they got stuck on the side of the screen…

Maybe we could limit the number of dashes a fighter can receive while stunned, say, to three? After that, they’d get launched to the ground.

I could even teleport the attacker right above the stunned enemy if it’s certain their dash will land, and then slam the enemy to the ground, without bouncing, but with a lot of smoke. After that, you could manually throw a ki wave towards him.

That would make for a very Dragon Ball–esque combo 🤔

So I ended up modifying quite a lot of things. I just hope I didn’t break anything else in the process:

• You can now dash-attack your opponent up to three times. This forms a dash combo.
• Rush attacks don’t count toward dash combos.
• On the third dash combo, your fighter will teleport above the opponent and smash them into the ground.
• I also added the “dead” frame for when a fighter finishes bouncing and lies down on the ground.
• You can’t punch a fighter in the “dead” state, but you can throw ki blasts at them.

Unfortunately, I’m not as good as you when it comes to pulling off combos, so testing all this is a bit tricky for me 😅
Please give it another try and let me know what you think!

This new update seems to have caused a glitch. I think it was after a button-mash combo, suddenly, the characters couldn't hit each-other anymore. Punches just pushed each-other around, nobody was doing any damage.

I'm glad you liked them!

Ok, so there's actually a few things I want to talk about here.

First of all, the way I got my opponent stuck on the side of the screen is actually very unlikely to happen, as I was trying to force it for the clip, and is also kind of hard to pull off, so I don't even know if you should bother to fix it, but if you do, I also figured out how it works: First, it only works on the left side of the screen, you and your opponent have to be completely stuck to the left wall, and your character has to be below their opponent, and then perform an Up Dash Attack, that way you can easily kill your enemy by spamming Up Dash Attack.

So as I said, it only works on the left side, and the reason why it happens it's because of the interaction between the enemy and the Dash Attack in that part of the map, it should send the enemy flying towards the center of the screen, what does happen on the right side of the map, but instead it sends them straight up.

Second, I tried all the changes you made, and I really like having a finisher move for your combos, but I don't think the game should limit the amount of Dash Attacks you can do against a flying enemy, because that's actually the funniest part, trying to keep your opponent in the air as long as possible before they can recover, and also three times seem too low, because in the same video I sent earlier you can see how I managed to connect more than seven Dash Attacks in the air, and I'm pretty sure you can connect more, so I don't think it's necessary to nerf it because of the corner exploit, as it is the only real issue regarding air Dash Attacks and it's already pretty hard to achieve in a real battle.

But as I said, I really liked the slamming your enemy to the ground part, I tested it and it feels very satisfying to do and extend it with Ki Blasts/Waves, although sometimes the enemy would instantly recover after hitting the ground and would not stay in the dead frame. Despite that, it does mimic the series' classic combos and even the way other DB games handle them, but maybe instead of being the automatic outcome for your combo, it could be a manual move like performing a Down Dash Attack after already having connected three or more air Dash Attacks to the flying enemy, or something like that, but that's up to you.

And third and lastly, while I was trying the new stuff out in story mode, something pretty weird happened after fighting for a while in all battles..

It happens after hitting each other with Melee attacks for some time, my enemies can't Dash Attack or hurt me with Melee attacks, and sometimes I can't hurt them phisically either; they come back to normal after hitting me with a Ki Blast or Ki Wave.

A couple things I would like to add: I would also sometimes encounter characters on the dead frame while stuck in the air and/or after losing a Melee Clash, you can still perform the left wall exploit with Ki Blasts without needing to use more than three Dash Attacks, and I tested all this in Hard and God Difficulty.

Thanks for reading!!

Thanks! The bug should now be fixed. I made sure the fighter can't enter the "dead" state during close combat or ki clashes.

I limited the number of dash attacks you can land while airborne simply because you might be playing against a human, not just an AI, and spending half the fight being juggled in the air isn’t exactly fun for the other player. The current limit is 3, but it can be adjusted. I personally haven’t managed to pull off more than 2 😅

Could you make a video of a full combo?
3 dash hits, ground smash, then a ki wave? 🤩

I've just tested the dash attack on the left side of the screen. I'm going to fix this, but this is practical for me in order to test the combo. Turns out that starting to combo_dash = 0 up to 3 makes 4 dash attacks, not 3. So I'm going to fix that too.

Edit: And it's done.

Hey! I've playing today and I noticed some things I missed yesterday, guess I was too sleepy. 😅

I had not noticed that you could actually teleport from anywhere to hit your enemy on the third Dash Attack, even if you're not close, that's sick.

I tried replicating the combo finisher on story mode but it was not possible, for two reasons:

First, the strange bug where you and/or your enemy can't hit each other still happened to me, and second, when the CPU is controlling the enemy, they will instantly recover, not staying on the dead frame and leaving no time for me to hit them with the Ki Wave.

I still recorded some clips on versus mode so you know how it would look like:

Thanks for the video and feedback ❤️

• I think I’ve fixed the soft lock issue for fighters in no-hit mode.
• I also added a teleport sound for the third dash, so it’s clearer what’s happening.
• The CPU (and the player, too) can no longer recover with a double tap once lying dead on the ground. However, I’m concerned this might lead to new issues, like being able to fire multiple ki waves at someone who’s down. This needs testing.

Bonsoir,
Avant que je ne continue de lire à propos de BASTON (j'ai grandement surestimé ma gestion du temps), je viens faire un feedback ici.

Je trouve que le fait qu'on ne puisse plus se relever aussi longtemps gâche un peu le jeu. On peut effectivement se faire spam par l'adversaire, et ça pourrait mettre un terme au match sans qu'on ait pu réellement faire quoi que ce soit.

T'as testé, ou c'est simplement ton avis ? 😅

Il faut tester. Pour voir si c'est gérable en réglant la durée allongé au sol, ou si je réactive le double tap pour un recover, même quand on est allongé.
Dans ce cas, je peux régler la probabilité que l'IA le fasse.

Hello again. 😄

The no hit bug is indeed fixed now, and the teleport sound makes it so much clearer to know what's happening.

I was able to test the combo finisher against the cpu, and now it works the intended way. There's one thing though, sometimes when your third Dash Attack is too diagonal or too close to the corners/ground, the enemy will bounce off the ground instead of staying in the dead state.

Now, talking about the time a character lasts in the dead state, I think it's correct, but maybe it could be a bit less, because it's enough to land a full charged Ki Wave but only if you already had the Ki for it, therefore also allowing you to land a full charged special ability if you have it. (Depending on the ability).

I do find a problem though, I think it's too easy to complete, it's a high prize for almost no challenge nor risk, you're technically being able to land a full charged special ability with two moves, but it should be hard to achieve. My suggestion is to increase the Dash Attacks needed to perform it to 5/6, depending on what Dash Attack you consider the first one, cause the first and last one are pretty much free.

Moving on to something else, I noticed that a character also gets stuck in the dead state if they get hit by a large Ki Wave/special attack, and I think this shouldn't happen, because that lets you link together several Ki Waves in a row, and if you connect this with the Dash Attack combo you can easily kill your opponent. I think a character should get stuck in the dead state only after the Dash combo and after losing a Melee Clash.

I would also like to mention that I'd love to know what other players think about this move, whether they think it's easy or hard, I'm very curious about that. 😅